Looking Back at 2020 and Setting Goals for 2021 | Real Estate Notes Show

we're going hey everybody dave putz here from jkp holdings nathan turner over here canadian no guy over here just joining you this friday afternoon or friday morning for that matter nate how you been man how are things going i'm good i'm just thinking you actually probably got buried with snow this yeah it's been a little hectic i would say um it was uh expected about a dusting and maybe an inch my kids were excited about getting about three to four inches in a matter of a couple hours yeah um and now snow blowing at 7 30 at night so it's been a it's been a week i'm sure you are you guys getting any snow yet we've had a little bit like there's nothing on the ground right now we we totally missed that storm all together it just started just south of us so we didn't get to see any of it oh i i i have to say i'm a little jealous that's that's goodness my kids are upset there's no like missing school right now they're like yeah snow day they're still stuck at school so i guess in that aspect it's it's been pretty good so you know 2020 has been a whirlwind change and weirdly enough in the last 10 plus years we've been doing this notes have gone inflow i think we talked about year plus ago and september was a time frame things went low yeah 2020 was one of those kind of years it was an interesting year it was it was odd because um i mean obviously early on there's a lot of uncertainty and like what's going to happen and everyone was totally on edge and so a lot of things kind of like almost stopped it came to a very much of a very slow crawl there for a little while but yeah interestingly enough um i mean i resell everything i buy right so i actually this is actually my best year ever and then buying two i didn't really have very much of an issue finding anything to purchase this year so that's that's been great yeah it's been one of those years where it didn't make sense um and we're seeing inventory i mean we're talking before camera rolling and that with inventory with it was i think that there the inventory was evan flow for all year long but we didn't see a lot for a couple months because no one knew what to expect i think time frames for foreclosures were kind of screwy and people were kind of holding steady while at the same time pricing was outrageous at points bad points yeah and you kind of had to navigate that a little bit um hopefully everyone did that well and yeah you know got by okay but but yeah with timelines being screwed up again kind of not as bad obviously as what it was back in 2010-11 yeah where delays were outrageous um there are still counties that are not opened up yet i've got a good county loan that was supposed to foreclose in march or april and it's indefinite at this point so who knows when that's gonna happen but anyway but it's been an interesting year uh the one of the surprising things to me was that um with all we've heard on the news and everything else about uh people not being able to make payments and things i i think you and i talked about this but i've talked with several other no people and when we look at our own portfolios we're not seeing a huge drop correct yeah it's interesting and so i'm not exactly sure what that means for the future uh if we're going to see the the tidal wave of non-performers come like everyone is kind of talking about yeah that sounds right but when you talk to people that are in the business their default rate has not gone up significantly so no and we all expected it we're all like oh crap you know we talk private leader groups and it's like this this is not good guys you know what are you gonna do how are you gonna handle it um and you know one of our key things that we talked about is we don't want to get to a point where have to foreclose on people right we don't want to get into the oreo and eviction situation because both know that's a whirlwind right now yeah and they it's it's nurse to say that however we found that most people continue to perform yeah um was it helped by the government maybe but i don't know i don't know i never would be able to put that together most of them i think two defaulted through i think we got like a two or three percent default rate and that was it which was shocking yeah yeah and and it's hard to know you know and i don't know that we're gonna have the data on this for at least another couple of months because how much of that was government funding help propping things up and how much of that was just for variances but even for variances i didn't have a lot of those i don't think a lot of people had no not the ones i've talked to i think it's more that other side of it when things went haywire um is when things went a little nuts for me for people's so i think that with 1020 people just went on pause but they were telling still paying their bills that i agree with you government lifting them up was a huge part of all that but i think that you know i'm curious where the job loss was was it in you know wasn't as bad as it was was it going on in different sectors it just didn't affect us um you know and i think that you know which of the 20 as it laid out it what was broadcasted live and and all the worries is different from what really happened in different aspects without getting political and i think that that just you're right we're not going to understand any of this for months down the line yeah so it'll be interesting to see what the true fallout really is because it's it's too early to tell we've had government help all along the way and i suspect that with the new government we're going to see more of that coming along the lines that's kind of their mo and so it's likely that we're going to see more of that propping up and but then the question is how long can that last you can't just keep paying people to do nothing forever that doesn't work yeah i know that i recently got sent a message somebody said they're putting out no stimulus plan possum monday um i heard about henry that i didn't read the details of it but you know what does that mean for us and will they kick down the curb foreclosure for all the federally backed loans and i don't know that's a big big question for us um you know it's hard to say that it's hard to imagine that this won't have a tremendous effect but so far we're not really seeing it so don't know yeah so far we're just not seeing it yeah and i don't know if you know we're looking at a pool of non-performers now and you know the question is do we jump on it with this whole vaccine coming through and i don't know what that looks like um i'm not sure yeah it's it it sets up a weird 2021 um yeah because there's so many unknowns and i mean this is it's interesting because even i think of a year ago before colgate hit when we were at the i am in conference yeah i mean at every imn conference frankly when you're they're doing the grand overview and it's like well if the fed does this then this might happen but if they do that then this might happen so it's always out but this just takes it to a whole other level yeah it's a mixture between code situation the government changing you know whatever aisle you fall and you fall on um and not knowing what they're gonna do and then how they're gonna handle this kind of stuff so it's pretty interesting and i'd love to see what other people impression of children 20 was so feel free to put a post up or a comment in the box and you know this is an open conversation and it leads to like you said what's going to happen in 2021 and i i like the fact that you want to talk about goal setting and achievable things that we kind of hold accountability there um and with the unknowns it makes it a little more difficult but really kind of focus you on what you should be doing every day absolutely you know it part of it is interesting we're all kind of waiting for another tidal wave but at the same time like we're saying we're still seeing product and a lot of it is a recycled product and a large percentage of that is still from 2008 fallout yeah it has not gone away it's not a problem that's just disappeared so with that and then with uncertainty surely surely we're in for another you know correction crash whatever it might be um i expect we'll see more product coming on online here in the next anywhere from 6 to 18 months i i don't know but yeah surely yeah and i think that you know we just said that all product has come back i mean fannie mae and freddie were selling and they're stopping each other in 10 2013 they just started in the last couple years selling stuff so all that inventory is still not trickling down yet that's right um the big funds that are buying 100 500 million from fannie they're still buying like crazy and it's still old inventory yeah so it's like that's slowly trickling down and they didn't want to sell anything because they didn't want the whirlwind of selling it so i think that i'm curious what the inventory will trick it down because most of those big boys are selling now to other big boys that weren't around 10 years ago so what inventory will trickle down through that filter that wasn't there when we began that's a good point they weren't there there was no outlet 10 years ago so now they're there most definitely is and so now they've they've got somewhere to put it you know and you know will they get rid of low-level fruit kind of hanging out there will they get rid of high-level stuff will they bulk off like they did before um do they have the infrastructure that was the reason they didn't get involved in forest they didn't have the infrastructure they do now and the servicing is totally different things we have services was created out of this whole thing absolutely you know madison was created from this stuff so i'm curious what it's going to be like um but with that said with all these unknowns i love to talk about where we look to do what we want to learn in as as investors and what do we want to focus on coming in this six to 12 months and where do we see ourselves in a 12-month period so give me some bullet points we'll go back and forth on this what are you looking to focus on so i mean i'm doubling down i'm i'm starting a fund and putting that together now i'm just kind of hammering out details on that and it'll be ready early in the new year uh not that i'm advertising that that's good i'm just mentioning that's coming but that's that's what i'm doing uh so i'm i'm getting ready and i'm fully expecting um you know between between what's already out there and what i expect to be coming down the pipeline here in the near future um i'm getting ready for that and what kind of inventory are you looking at purchasing that lower level cfds first seconds performing non-performing you know it's been really interesting in preparation for this we've been doing a lot of analysis um so i mean five years ago when i started buying loans the way i am now um i was really going after the low low stuff so like property values between 30 and 60 75 maybe uh and and looking at over the last years what we've closed and what's gone well and what hasn't guess what yeah it didn't cause one problem with that kind of property and your profits are gone that's it so i had a lot of really great home runs but if i look at you know over the last three years i think there were eight times where it was a loss uh every one of those was you know property value under 50 000.

yeah so so that's that's my target has shifted over time and now i'm looking still between 50 and about 150 property value and then we go back to our conversation last time about how do you how do you bid on that and things like that and that's it go watch it but yeah yeah but that's that's what i'm looking at yeah and i think that you know we came to a conclusion as well that those low-level fruit is attractive when you first get in because you can buy five ten thousand dollar purchase yeah um but when you get into the thick of things the cost is not based on the property value foreclosure cost is the set price no matter what you do yeah so to get a higher value property the percentage of rehabbing a bathroom for five ten grand in subject a at 30 grand value versus a hundred thousand house the the dollar amount goes up a little bit but not so much it makes a killer situation when you buy a house our first property was worth 30 grand and just to do a kitchen was like three grand like holy god like it killed the deal it's ten percent yeah exactly it it gets into that kind of stuff so you know i needed that one yeah it's funny because even the home runs on those percentage-wise it looks fantastic i'm bringing home three thousand dollars they're like yeah like ten percent i mean three ten percent it sounds wonderful you know i made a 30 return he was like oh that's great you know but i think that you know pete there's still people chasing that dollar amount and i think that i'm not saying not to do that no for sure i think that yeah huge risk because when pricing was different before it's different but you yeah you know i think that when you're first getting in i'm encouraging people to buy partials yeah i think it's a great way to get in with five or six thousand dollars to not make the headaches and mistakes that we made and not get into a non-performer in you know cincinnati ohio or sandusky ohio or wherever you're buying that right or memphis sc and instead of buying a 30 000 asset maybe you can get a nice property in florida or a property in texas that's performing and you just you buy a partial it whatever yield you're looking for for a period of three four years and you fund the seller to go buy more assets yeah and then it works out and then it goes and gives you more stuff i think that is a great avenue for people who have roth ira five six thousand dollars go approach someone who has a seller who is a performing assets listen can i buy your payments you get the skill level you get the experience you get the personal sale agreement and you make a relationship yeah and it's a great return on a partial as well so it's something we're looking at yeah they're so great they really are they're kind of a subset of everything that we're doing yeah there's so many subsets and you know i think that what we're looking to focus on is still buying that property value 50 grand or higher yeah um aaron quinn said hello by the way so um so i think that with everything going on i'm looking at buying assets that are you know still in a 50 to 300 000 property value um depending on what state you know we're looking at states in the you know the southeast usually but we're looking at other states we have a few states we're starting to avoid ohio's one states i don't like anymore for multiple reasons yeah high frames and whatnot but i think that we're looking at you know we're still looking first um we're still looking at by performing and not performing assets um we're buying seconds performing most of the time um we don't buy too many non-performers i couldn't have given men but we're looking at buying more of those down assets 220 we we were just kind of in a freeze bubble in the last 10 years we've been buying this kind of assets but our what we did in 2020 is we kind of change our percentage of returns on non-performing assets with the uncertainty of how long we have to hold this thing until we get out right you know if we get stuck in a bk situation holy crap so in 2021 we're going to be hesitant and increase our our required returns for non-performer until we have an idea of what's going to happen because we don't know time frames yeah but we're going to still focus on those big assets of you know over 50 grand of value um we're going to try getting the sim cfds if we can find them at that value but we're really just looking at getting into some commercial stuff some mixed use stuff um we're thinking that's gonna come to fruition it is something i haven't bought before so i'm kind of curious about that you're looking at office space office space maybe a restaurant that went out of business and see if we can kind of buy the note on it and you know save the business like we'd save the homeowners right and buy it for a good price get it maybe performing because we get this whole thing open up and maybe some ideas and work with people smarter than i am to figure out how to make that happen and understand how commercial notes are different from residential and understand that front piece that's one of the learning experiences i'm hoping um if anyone's listening knows that some experience on that i'd love to talk to you buying those kind of notes could make it never having you an angle on what we're looking to do um new learning experience as well i don't see a lot of commercial i don't know what your tape's been in the past i don't either i'd be interested in in exploring it but but same i don't see a lot but i'm also not looking for it so i wonder if i went looking for it uh how easy or hard it would be to find you know we have a few people like massachusetts and whatnot that gives us like autumn offs um and we have a few brokers that we've both know that have some great inventory that we go from there um sean just has a question how to go from zero to 100 notes from 2021.

um you know the biggest thing is get in get tapes get inventory and attend online webinars as well as conferences you're going to find sellers that way and investors who may want to get out right now like crap i'm out of here i have 20 assets i want to just get rid of stuff um so sean if that's the kind of question you're looking at like how to get into that next level you know i would always give caution though if you're going from zero to go from zero to 100 that's a huge leap yeah a huge leap that's that's zero to one is big right that's eating the whole elephant all at once that's that's a big jump but if you can go zero to ten and figure out how to manage those ten and then you know go from ten to twenty uh that's how advice going about that and trying to just go and buy a hundred dollars yeah or the ten thousand that we know well um so you know i think it the big thing on that is systems and i think what we want to do is you know keep pushing our systems keep making them better we're always improving our systems um and you know we looked at looking at buying seller finance notes that kind of fallen off for whatever reason yeah i think we're looking at doing um ten notes guys not a hundred yes um but just you mean go 100 miles an hour so i think though with with this situation is we're looking at doing buying seller finance notes and look at county records um because that may be another angle so yeah commercial notes is something we want to get into we want to look into our finance and really kind of dive down besides buying lists um i don't know if you've bought lists in the past we have and i the one that stands out to me was we bought a note and the no on one of the notes on the list that we liked a lot um was released by the county government in 1985.

oh wow so maybe i had a bad situation maybe i've experienced but i said this is crazy um i bought it with our friend liz and i'm like this is just nuts and i it just gave me a sour taste so we want to find different way of doing that and as most people know i like optimization but i'd love to find out that seller finance duration that works out and we can kind of go from county to county year by year and kind of allocate which ones are yeah a lot of people have asked about buying from banks what's your knowledge experience what you've heard from people buying from banks my experience uh here's a i'll tell you so um i back in 2010 uh that was that was one of the things you heard about when i first was getting started so yeah you can buy directly from bank so i i went in i was i had a project going in columbus ohio so we went in in fact not even in columbus we went um i don't remember the town just a suburb and it was just a little local bank yep you know three branches in the whole state that kind of thing just a small guy because that's made sense to go to the smaller guys and you're not going to buy from bank of america all that kind of thing so when and talk to them brick wall i mean there's no i it's i'm sure it's possible i mean obviously banks are selling to somebody yeah not to me yeah and i know there's some software out there to kind of track that kind of stuff to see where inventory is that but i i've heard a lot of people make this suggestion to try it out um i've heard very little success uh a friend of ours adam i had a slam dunk in san antonio a couple years ago yeah um and that went really crazy because the collateral was weird the funding was weird but i think that you know we this idea that banks sell so we should contact them don't always correlate because most time i promise you walk your local bank open bank account and ask the person how to desk how to get a hold of not performing or special assets they'll say what are you talking about exactly they have no idea um and you get that inventory usually i've seen a couple of tapes and it's like warehouse and factory so yeah you know and the other thing is if you're talking to a bank they're not going to sell off one or two or even 10 notes they want to sell off 100 or 300 or 500 at a time like they're talking big big dollars so for the general you know our level of mom and pop shops yeah yeah even the guy with you know five million dollars honestly you're gonna have a hard time placing that with the bank that's that's too small yeah you know unless you have a great in which is amazing if you have a great end i think that for us you know even the big funds that we know we talk to they're not buying from banks they're buying from each other right merrill lynch is buying from this fund and you know they're buying from freddy or they're buying you know all these big things are kind of intertwined it's weird how we more than we get into this the more we find it smaller is so tight yeah but we're you know we're buying from other investors i'll buy from you you buy from me and that's really how it goes because sometimes the deal for you you need to have a deal sunsets for whatever reason your investment wants to get paid off or you've held it for a period of time made a killing you got it reperforming and now you want to cash out that's right and i think that happens more than we want to believe it does even at the big note exchanges that's some investors selling to another investor that's not a bank listing it exactly right i don't think banks buying from banks is impossible but it's just it's a lot of work yeah hard work and your chances are not great so not to say never try it but so by next year where are you looking to be system-wise um inventory-wise structure-wise what's your first of all said by next year um by the end of next year currently i've got about 80 notes that i'm i'm dealing with um my goal for when i kind of first started was like oh wouldn't it be cool to have 100 notes and that i've kind of revised that a little bit just because because i started out with the little guys and i'm like 100 notes at three thousand dollars a pop profit what if i could do 50 notes you know at 10 000 profit each that that makes more sense so so that's kind of 100 notes is still on the still on you know my list of goals that i want to get but it's a different level of asset than i used to buy i'd like to have somewhere between three and four million deployed and you know in place so i've i've got about three to four million funding 100 notes that are cycling through one way or another yeah i i i see myself in the same situation is um one of the questions is what's the best way to collateralize when raising money um if you're talking collateralizing alone you can definitely do that there's not a lot of buyers that i've experienced i know david horn does some stuff with that you probably hook up at eddie speed um but collateralizing alone uh a collateralized a collateral paper is done it absolutely is done but just something we're not experiencing um but raising money doing it the way through a private equity like we are doing it um through personal funds or doing what nathan doing raising the fund is probably the best way to raise money um and what you're doing is basically saying you split profits um and structure the way you want to structure it through but then you can't advertise depending on what kind of fun you're running you can't advertise you can't talk about it um and whatnot so that would be a good way to raise money that way unless you can do other ways you know again we have private equity so i'm not uh i'm not stuck on doing a fund where i'm raising capital but i think for us getting to a spot where we're buying loans on a regular basis is key for us uh but we also like you i'm not looking to buy a thousand loans next year if it comes up it comes up our my funding partners in the eye we're more about buying the asset by buying numbers um i don't care if i buy one loan or buy a hundred if i buy a hundred they're all they don't work then they don't work yeah we're not in a rush i'm not looking to compete but somebody else is saying well you bought 10 i have to buy 10.

right it doesn't always work that way what works for you doesn't work for me works out so i think that for us is i want to get more systems in place you know i want to get in a position where we're buying a little different notes i want to learn about stuff and i need to get one commercial deal on our belt just want to get the experience i also want to work on finding the methodology to find the seller financing without using a list to buy from um and i really think that would be a good avenue because of all the stuff that's going on now there's gonna be a lot of people in bad shape yeah for one reason or another yeah and we're not gonna get those from lists hopefully uh we're gonna get them from local people just putting the county records out there they they have a mortgage on file they put the lien and we get a hold of it um are you to get in the tax liens or income mechanic liens i i recently talked to a fellow that does tax liens and and he is telling me how how it's so much better than notes and so i'm i'm curious i'd like to look into it more but so far um i've had to redeem taxes on properties that i'm dealing with but i've never purchased accidents but it's it's an interesting avenue uh i'm not sure i fully understand it well enough to to do anything about it but uh but it's interesting we also been uh offered to buy mobile home park liens and stuff like that and i as much i love to explore and be interested in it it's just a whole new world to be learning about and i think that we're not done learning about this world not on buying in this world so moving on to another space just not for me um i'm not a big rental person i don't like rentals um but in i think that getting into that trail park idea is getting back into a rental scenario certifying scenario and just not for me um but you know with your systems with your funder you're coming out with we're not advertising people right we're just talking about funds now you know what systems do you need to have in place to do to get to another level for you guys so i i'm very hands-on which there's pluses and minuses to that um on the one hand i can't analyze an entire tape in five minutes um on the other hand i may find notes that the automated system would miss correct so that's uh and it's and it's a kind of a i don't want to say a gut feel but it's more of an art than a science yes in a lot of cases where if i'm looking at a tape uh you know i can look at my numbers and again an automated system might pass that up but i would look at it and identify ones that that would work for me because of abc yeah um so i i like doing that but it's funny to say that yeah it's funny second i was talking to our friend tim went down and we were talking about how do you truly do good valuation on property and we spent probably 20 minutes and we came up with i think 80 to 100 different points to make a property and we only spent 20 minutes on it so yeah railroad tracks schools churches you know crime there's so many things that go into play that you're right the gut feeling really tells you more than actual just numbers yeah yeah right and if you can get through that and get that that return is great but and it's something you learn it's something you kind of explain and talk about and say hey what do you think about this and you missed something or you know we have different opinions i've debated with people is crime a real factor when you're buying a note and to me i don't agree it is because people are still buying in crime areas i agree with you right it sucks it is what it is but people are still buying an area so they can still sell the property yeah you may not like living there bars in the windows that i don't want to do but it's not about that yeah so i agree with you organization does help that i think that it's hard to teach somebody how to analyze a property value it is it's tough it's tough so so as far as systems that's one that i looked at kind of some kind of an automation like you do but i actually prefer doing it manually um one of the biggest things that has that really kind of took me to another level was um just like a tracking software and i use pipedrive and uh i think it's fantastic it helps me keep organized and notes and phone calls and everything is just all in one place and i can keep it all together so let's explain a little bit about what that does is it a to-do list for those who are not familiar with pipedrive so pipedrive for me in the node space so it's it's a crm uh customer relations management tool and um to me the biggest advantage to pipedrive is that my gmail is in pipedrive live so i don't have to go and download it several times a day or anything like that and update it it just it's automatic if something comes into my gmail it automatically shows up on my drive so then from there i can attach an email uh to a specific property to a specific loan that i'm dealing with and then i can go into that loan and i can you know create notes and i've got all the property information all the loan information everything that i want all in one place and then and then on top of that then it also has like a task list so i can set it so that every day i know exactly what i do when i get into the office if it's on the list for that day that's what i do and then you know i set it yeah for the next day if i need to follow up i'll set it for a week for now to follow up and just it helps keep everything very organized and make sure nothing falls through the cracks do you remember what the cost of that is a month i forget what it is i don't i think i paid yearly i gosh 100 200 a year or something i don't remember that's all good not terribly expensive but extremely um and those i know that um sean mentioned going from zero to ten loans yeah you don't know you don't know yeah i hate to scare you off with that but get your first loan and get and get a feel for it um if you buy a first loans performer it's gonna be really easy you're tracking your payments you know there's no servicing notes you're just checking it monthly and excited when that check comes in and they get pissed off when you realize that your p i is not your p and i coming into the bank account right um escrow hits or whatever so i think that when we do stuff like that having that system in place is you don't know what systems you need until you do it um and what works for you works for someone else it doesn't work for someone else um but i do agree learning the system is a good thing pipedrive is an option um we've used in trello we've used google sheets and whatnot but there's no right way or wrong way we use trello for we use trello for just for tracking uh deal situations um we also use a google sheet with automated emails so that if something comes up or flat comes up like hey we didn't receive our payment for 60 days on this loan i'll get an email from that sheet saying hey listen this we were this loan has been out and then it also shoots out um i'll get an email daily of all the tasks i have to do on all my loans to know what it is um and an email goes out to my system to also describe what we need to get done um and like you say it's what works for you i know you're a big spreadsheet person so that yep that works really well for you i actually transferred from spreadsheets over to pipedrive because to me it was getting way too complicated way too you know i had my color coding going on and you know what for 10 notes that's fine absolutely after about 50 notes or so that gets cumbersome yes and it gets confusing so you have to switch over that's something yeah i am missing timelines and deadlines is huge in space right um time is of the essence especially for you know if that ninety days delinquency happens you're sending that paper as soon as possible to get that clock starting yeah um if you're a situation where taxes are due you need to make sure or force place insurance is due or if you're doing force now the question is do you do force placement insurance or not these are kind of things you don't even think about well of course you do well guess what how many first place insurance policies have i actually got funds from different than i thought i wanted right you're excited you got insurance in place something happened you're like i can prove it it's perfect and so no for whatever crazy reason it's a no actually i just got paid out on one i just well i haven't received the check yet but they just notified me that i'm going to get the check on one it was actually in port arthur okay they got the hurricane twice this season so that that needed it so i paid for these turns yeah so that worked um and it's honestly it wasn't as high as i was hoping as i was gonna get but the house wasn't destroyed either so yeah it will be okay but anyway yeah um so i'm glad we talked about 2021 our goals and stuff like that i think our numbers are going to be dependent on what happens but i love i'd love to pick up another 20 25 more assets um in 2021 if the numbers work out we'll go to 50 to 100 without a problem um we are looking to buy more pools than we did in the past um we've bought pools in 2020 we've all pulled in 20 20 19.

um but in the last six months we're buying one to choose it again just because the inventory has been kind of weird for us yeah um we just we're kind of dialed in yeah definitely looking at pools uh i'm i'm optimistic that it would be a poor economy going ahead this is true the house price is really high still here which is amazing um sell houses are still selling like this um a property on my block is selling for if i would have bpo'd it probably it's selling for about 15 higher than it should i don't know why i don't get it um it's just what's available well in refinance uh raids are still record low so that's actually been a really cool thing in the last year and a half or so we've had several payoffs much more than i have in past years interest rates are so low that people are refinancing yeah encourage that yeah and if anyone here has a mortgage we're actually doing it right now and i'm like holy crap i'm saving our money and whatnot it's amazing we thought our rates were low beforehand we're dropping down again to refinance out and continue and my mortgage guy's like hey let me explain more amortization scheduled to you i'm like don't bother i'm okay i got this yeah so you know but i think that going from you know getting your first law and all stuff this is a great opportunity to just sit down with people who aren't doing as much as they did until 19 and and work with them there's different avenues you can help out and mentor and broker and whatnot and just getting out there um there is a lot of inventory that circle around i personally got a phone call with it you know if you're buying your first loan or whatever get a phone call a couple sellers and just pick the brand hey listen looking what can i do to get an acid off your plate what acid are you most looking to sell off you know um don't ask the question why because you question yourself if the truth answers coming out or not right um but just dot your eyes cross your t's talk to your attorney and get things done like aaron quinn uh who's listening in on but you know i think that 2021 can be a really good year just be open-minded and look around yeah there are so many opportunities on the horizon so just be aware keep your head up yeah well guys we're gonna take off next week uh christmas is happening and uh my wife would kill me if we did one of these things during the day for her um and i think we're gonna reconvene uh either the following week during the week or the following week after that i hope these are pretty helpful for you nate i appreciate ben uh yeah jumping in with you i think the first time we actually met we haven't been on a plane flight home it's been great yes um chat with you and and spend time with me man um but uh let's let's reconvene next week uh the fun week and we'll see what's going on yeah you bet thanks guys all right.